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/co/, please forgive me but I have to be honest. I hate Tim Burtons Batman. It is absolute shit. It misses the entire point of Batmans character, what he does and why he does it. It is tacky, cliche, predictable and above all very formulaic. It is too juvenile to be a film for grown ups and too unimaginative to interest children. Keatons performance is decent but he hasn't got anything good to work with. Nicholson steals the show simply by being Nicholson. The actor had no real interest in the character or the role and accepted it only on a massive pay check and with borderline crazy demands. It is perhaps his weakest performance, a far cry from Jack Torrance. While his Joker is occasionally threatening he is rarely funny and seems more like a silly lackey to some real Batman nemesis who remains hidden the entire film. The Joker, like Batman, is not true to character and is given a very Hollywood origin that is cringe-worthy in its cheesiness and predictability. Gough is acceptable as Alfred but beyond that the supporting cast are a joke. The tacked on love interest is dull, dull, dull and the standard comic fare that all the over side-characters exist for is forgettable, but thankfully shortly over. It is one of Burtons worst pictures, although it is clear he did not have a great deal of control over the production. Nonetheless his cinematography stands out (Out of place, in such an otherwise typical, dull film) and it is his direction in the films climax that makes it the films only truly memorable scene. The sequel was by far a more Burton-esque film and is better for it. Pic Related.
Anonymous
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>>25547084 At what point is this revelation?
Also choosing Prince to write songs for the joker was a stroke of genius, partyman kicks ass.
Anonymous
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You're right. About everything. Except I hate Burton's style so the second film is worse for me. Neither of them are good
Anonymous
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Best Batman movie was Batman Forever!!!!
Anonymous
>Returns is better than Batman
Anonymous
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I don't hate either of them but I can't really say I love them or anything. They were pretty good for their time and they're just okay now.
Anonymous
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>>25547287 The focus is more on just how bad Batman is. I constantly hear /co/ raving about it and calling Nicholsons Joker a stroke of genius, and other such lies etc. but having seen it a few times now I can firmly state that the consensus I have come across is well off the mark.
Anonymous
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prolly gonna get called a troll, but I actually didn't really like nicholson as the joker.
Anonymous
You're serious, aren't you? Look, I'll give you there are a fuckton of missteps storywise but apart from Gordon the cast is the only thing that holds up. Keaton's a shockingly good choice for Bruce (not Batman I'll grant you, but a great Bruce). And while I don't quite subscribe to the idea of Batman is so diverse as a character, any interpretation is good, that is much more true of the Joker and Nicholson, post disfigurement, milks every scene he's in. Nicholson loved that character. If you think he was just playing Nicholson, watch the pre-transformation. Returns didn't get anyone right. Its only worth it to watch Christopher Walken own the whole show and Michelle Pfeiffer in a skin tight suit going bonkers, though that's as close to Catwoman as your mom is. The recently departed Michael Gough, however, was, that one idiotic plot point not withstanding, a fine choice for the time. I'll agree with you there.
Anonymous
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I never could get into burton batman
Anonymous
nolan batman is still good, right?
Anonymous
Batman Returns completely missed the point of Batman. Burton didn't know shit about Batman so he made up his own stupid shit. Horrible movie.
Anonymous
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>>25547587 relax, nolan batman was never good
Dr Dave's Freetrevor in Misery > "Awefleeze Gutterlass" Wyattbaioklu K. Solarislad !Jlxf0tkskY
Dr Dave's Freetrevor in Misery > "Awefleeze Gutterlass" Wyattbaioklu K. Solarislad !Jlxf0tkskY Sun 01 May 2011 19:04:00 No. 25547626 Report >my face when people finally figure out that the only thing that actually held the Nolan movies up was his semi-competent directing and everything past the first act of Batman Begins is a fucking mess >10 years from now
Anonymous
Anonymous
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>>25547596 The point of Batman is: parents dead, fight crime. That's fucking it.
OP !HGwqeD//8k
>>25547516 OP here.
You are right on a lot of points. Keaton is a serviceable Batman and a good Bruce, however as I said he doesn't have great material to work with. Nicholson pre-transformation is also quite fun. It's a shame that for most of the money post-transformation he becomes a prancing pillock, however.
As for the sequel, lets not forget DeVito! He did a fine job in that role, and made for a terrific, pitiful, creepy, and for once genuinely tragic Penguin.
Anonymous
I do love the one moment on the dance floor when Pfeiffer & Keaton realize who the other is. That grasp and that "what do we do now" was very emotional. It wasn't cunning or witty, it was truly one on-the-edge-of-nuts woman and her mate realizing they should be tearing each other apart, and not wanting to let go of the moment. Obviously, its one of my most memorable movie moments.
OP !HGwqeD//8k
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>>25547596 I like it as a Burton film, but not as a Batman film.
Anonymous
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>>25547516 what? Keaton was a shittastic Bruce and wasn't that great of a Batman either but at least his voice was Batmanesque.
Anonymous
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>>25547626 >mfw you choke on your own pretentious hipster douchbaggery Anonymous
>>25547626 I can understand thinking they're overrated, but the only thing truly bad about the nolan movies was Batman's ridiculous death metal voice.
Anonymous
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>>25547648 >As for the sequel, lets not forget DeVito! He did a fine job in that role, and made for a terrific, pitiful, creepy, and for once genuinely tragic Penguin. laughing girls.jpg
Anonymous
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>>25547626 I like TDK, overrated though it may be. Although you re right about Batman Begins, it is a shambles.
>>25547655 Such a great scene
Anonymous
>>25547648 DeVito was fun to watch but that was hardly Penguin. But as you say, given what he had to work with...
I'll have to agree to disagree on Joker, but that was my live action Joker after Romero, so it came as a welcome shock. It was like only me and my cousin knew Joker was a killer until 1989. I will agree he's less Jack Torrence, but there is a certain amount of McMurphy in there, just dialed way the hell up.
Anonymous
>>25547714 Oh that. Gguuuuh. even Conroy's said that someone should have pulled Bale aside and said something. But they'd probably stumble away missing teeth.
Anonymous
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>>25547766 I've always considered Penguin to be one of the weakest of Batmans foes (I'm talking dramatically and thematically here, not like "Oh he's a weak guy he has a gym membership but he never goes I don't know why he even bothers") and conversely the villain DeVito played, very different from the Penguin of the books, to be an outstanding villain. But, say what you will.
No doubt though, Nicholsons performance as the Joker was far better than... earlier interpretations
Anonymous
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>>25547798 There are several scenes in The Dark Kight where you can hear Bale practically choking on his words, probably due to having to do multiple takes with that ridiculous voice. He also seems to be out of breath a lot.
I hope after the strong negative feedback to the GRAVELLY voice they tone it down in the next film.
Dr Dave's Freetrevor in Misery > "Awefleeze Gutterlass" Wyattbaioklu K. Solarislad !Jlxf0tkskY
Dr Dave's Freetrevor in Misery > "Awefleeze Gutterlass" Wyattbaioklu K. Solarislad !Jlxf0tkskY Sun 01 May 2011 19:31:00 No. 25547955 Report The shitty Bale voice was amplified and run through countless shitifying audio filters in post, by the way. That's all on Nolan.
Anonymous
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I think it's very interesting that only Burton movie with strong sex themes is directed to kids... Most creative from all Batman movies, with great characters, symbolism and story.Nolan's Batman is almost perfect action/gangster movies, but they didn't bring anything new to the genre. Burton>Nolan
Anonymous
>>25547955 I don't understand why they needed to do that shit to begin with. Bale's batman voice was fine in Begins.
Anonymous
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With all due respect, I respectfully disagree. The Tim Burton films are fun. Sure, they don't get everything right but so what? It did things differently and was entertaining. And above all, the films had a great impact on pop culture, over a night the public transitioned themselves from thinking of the lighthearted and campy Adam West Batman to a darker, gritty Batman of the modern day,
Anonymous
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>>25547971 If they had not done it, people would whine about the "WHY WON'T ANYONE NOTICE THAT IT'S BRUCE WAYNE, IT'S THE SAME VOICE!"
Anonymous
>Nicholson steals the show simply by being Nicholson. The actor had no real interest in the character or the role and accepted it only on a massive pay check and with borderline crazy demands. I have heard that Nicholson is proud as hell of his performance as the joker, considering it to be Pop Art.
Anonymous
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>>25548041 Emphasis on the "pop". Some art.
Anonymous
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>>25547714 >only thing wrong >drives a roof tank >can't detect shit >model Gotham is models