/tg/ - Traditional Games » Thread #14749430

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Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 13:06:00 No.14749430 View View Reply Original Report

Hey /tg/, what's your favorite world of darkness theme book (correct term?) and why? I'm thinking about getting into WoD, but I'm not sure where to start. Hunter: The Vigil sounds like the best way for my group to transition into it, and it sounds pretty fun. Changeling: The Lost sounded really cool but I can't really think of how games like that would work.

Feel free to voice your comments or just ramble about your favorite WoD books, I don't really care, just need some insight before I get the books.

My group likes combat quite a bit but they are also great roleplayers who like story, They wouldn't care if we had combat-free/lite sessions. Vampire: the requiem is probably out of the question atm, thanks to twilight.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 13:12:00 No.14749499 Report

Quoted By:

Bamp, your opinions wanted /tg/!

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 13:38:00 No.14749797 Report

Quoted By:

Werewolf is a personal favorite just because it has lots of flavor, good fluff, and werewolves have always been my favorite monsters. But it's rules aren't so great.

Changeling is the most generally beloved around here, and it certainly deserves it. It's the only one I currently own.

Promethean is a joy to read, but I've never actually played it. It seems like it'd be a nightmare to actually attempt getting a group together.

Vampire is Vampire.

Mage... defeated me. I couldn't wrap my head around it. It was just so open-ended, my imagination failed and I could never think of what spells to cast. That was years ago though; I'd be willing to try again with a good DM.

Never read Geist.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:39:00 No.14752768 Report

Quoted By: >>14752809

DSotBH. Dirty Secrets of the Black Hand.
But it is a oWoD book of course...

Well... Vampire in World of Darkness predates Twilight and heavily influenced by Anne Rice aka Interview with the Vampire. I would think WoD vampire players will oppose the twilight-ism.
Whatever, I would suggest Hunter, a plain mortal play(normal chap with no psychic power or a hunter organisation powers), or a Changeling.

I liked the book Infernal but the reason was the books' powertinkering nature. Mage that ignores the restriction of mortal human by malevolent power with no downside. Best thing is you can make some custom powers that is forbidden to your character normally, with this book. Nice!

Armory I/II is the weapon book with some powerful combat styles(kungfu, spetznaz knife fighting, zweihander fighting manoeuvre etc) not bad if your players want fighting styles, but nWoD combat is really bad... Worse than oWoD, I would say. Though oWoD combat was very slow.

I liked Immortals book too. Immortal pc/npcs with weak(slight) magical powers not as powerful as vampire or werewolf.

Requiem for Rome is ... Vampire play for Ancient Rome. You makes ancient characters.

Changeling is PTSD characters I think but I skimmed the book so no real knowledge.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:46:00 No.14752809 Report

Quoted By:

OP, ignore this person.
>>14752768

They are the worst sort of person to put in your group.
>New Mage suxx
See?

SMAP

SMAP Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:47:00 No.14752811 Report

Quoted By: >>14752856 >>14752924

Mage the Awakening is an okay book, but most of the weight of making it awesome is on you, as the core book doesn't actually have a lot of depth to it. Boston and some of the other supplements go a long ways towards correcting this, though, and it's probably one of the more upbeat types of WoD games you can run.

Werewolf is cool and will definitely have a lot of combat, which you will be pretty kickass at. If it has a major flaw, it's that the archetype you represent is a bit less... universal than the other systems. Everyone knows there are different kinds of mages and vampires and monster-hunters thanks to modern fiction, but werewolves are still largely relegating to "angry and biting" as their schtick.

Hunter the Vigil is a neat book and will also have a lot of chasing and killing in it, but you can run it as more of a mystery thing if you want. Basically, it's an expansion of the WoD base book that lets you up the degree of competency of your dude by varying amounts.

Changeling the Lost is an awesome game (in my eyes, at least), but it is NOT a game about fights. Changelings are, mechanically, one of the more fragile supernaturals and their powers tend to be weaker overall. Stories are going to be much more focused on day-to-day life and coping with the world than in the other games, although of course mysteries, politics, and Terrible Things From Beyond are all going to make some appearances as well.

Promethean and Geist both look cool, but I don't have any personal experience with them. I would probably stay away from them in any case, as they tend to be a bit more esoteric than the others.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:50:00 No.14752834 Report

Quoted By:

I would recommend Geist and Changeling: The Lost. There's a lot of meat on them, far more interesting can the Vampire/Werewolf shenanigans. Mage is good, but involves a lot of butthurt from grognards who can't accept that something new can be better than something old.

Deathleaper's Fangirl !!YD/t8+iuFvd

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Deathleaper's Fangirl !!YD/t8+iuFvd Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:50:00 No.14752843 Report

Quoted By:

Changeling, man. There's just so much you can do with that game. It's got a wonderful theme and feel to it, something quite different from the other books in the WoD setting.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:52:00 No.14752856 Report

Quoted By: >>14752886 >>14752947

>>14752811

Actually, Changelings can be one of the most powerful of the PCs because their powers are small, but frequent and stack. They get boosts and buffs from making pledges with each other and following them, keeping deals. Then there's no real restriction for Contracts.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:52:00 No.14752859 Report

Quoted By:

I have to say I enjoy changeling alot. And Geist. And Mage. And Hunter. Vampire and werewolf I have trouble getting into, and Promethean... I can never find a group for.

So yeah.

Deathleaper's Fangirl !!YD/t8+iuFvd

Deathleaper's Fangirl !!YD/t8+iuFvd Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:56:00 No.14752886 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752856
The Pledge system can be horribly broken, if people are of a mind to abuse it, apparently. Which I suppose, in a way, is quite characterful - trying to look for loopholes in the wording of pledges and contracts to twist them to their best advantage seems rather appropriate. Changelings can become grotesquely powerful when they start stacking up pledges, contracts (especially in situations where they can hit their catches), and tokens.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 21:57:00 No.14752887 Report

Quoted By: >>14752945 >>14752984

My favorite is Vampire... provided your DM doesn't try to enforce that "YOU SEE A VAMPIRE YOU HAVEN'T SEEN BEFORE, CHECK FOR FRENZY." rule all the time. I mean, I get it, if my vamp is hunting and comes across another... That'd be a good time to check for frenzy. But don't make us check for frenzy at a dinner party. Christ.

Geist is really cool too, but it's harder to make a good game out of it. A lot of the work falls to the DM.

Promethean has interesting fluff, but I didn't like playing.

No experience with mage.

Hunter's good, especially for a group that doesn't want to learn all the supernatural rules right off the bat.

Changeling... Eh.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:03:00 No.14752924 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752811

None of the core books have depth in them.

I found Vampire VERY lacking until I picked up Belial's Brood, then my head exploded with possibilities.

Werewolf I can't quite find anything attractive about yet - It's a tiny bit tedious to read.

Mage is absolutely lovely from a thematic POV - It's so very rich in mood, theme, and conflict, that I can't help but enjoy it. I also like metaphysical chicanery. I also like how most of the Big Questions are answered with the Shrug of God, leaving it up to me to fill in the blanks.

And to make up my own cosmologies without the game/fanbase IMPLODING ON ITSELF.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:08:00 No.14752945 Report

Quoted By: >>14752962

>>14752887
They do specifically mention "at a dinner party" as a situation that grants you a huge bonus to your resist roll. But yeah, having a chance of irredeemably borking the masquerade every time you see another vampire doesn't stop being a potentially terrible rule if the chance is a small chance.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:09:00 No.14752947 Report

Quoted By: >>14753159

>>14752856
Also, fulfilling catches on 5 dot contracts is just YESSSSSSSS tier if you are a low level Changeling.

OP, you have clearly narrowed it down in the right direction. Hunter and Changeling are my respective favourites as well. Changeling requires a lot more worldbuilding work than Hunter, or indeed the average system, you generally need to have plotted out rather exact details on a LOT of different things before the game can even start. Things like peoples keepers, the local court system, the relevant points of contact and power within each court, the local goblin ecosystem, are all things that you can't really do on the fly as much as you often might.

Fortunately once you have all that stuff down on paper, it reverts to a very similar GMing pace, with only occasional on the fly setting fabrication necessary. Changeling is a very cerebral game, but it mainly stems from the starting state of the campaign.

Hunter on the other hand, whilst it can be anywhere from mystery to horror to action or even introspective contemplation of the implications being a hunter has on someone, can't really ever be as deep as Changeling. Thats a plus in some cases, but it gets a little frustrating as a GM once you start hitting the edges trying to expand the scope of the campaign.

SMAP

SMAP Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:12:00 No.14752962 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752945
Note that this is why Vampire societies (and parties) exist. You go in, you get introduced to the Prince & Co, you make all your rolls to avoid freaking out and get it all over with. Why? So that you have at least met everyone once and won't have to make the check whilst surrounded by mortals and potentially break the Masquerade.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:17:00 No.14752984 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752887
The "new vampire frenzy" rule is fine even in social situations as long as "you were expecting it" bonuses come into play. At worst a player will lose a WP point or have to be restrained and lose face a bit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:19:00 No.14752998 Report

Quoted By: >>14753154

I have yet to see the new vampire frenzy rule add anything meaningful to a story. It's not even a good monkey wrench for driving story in different directions. And the really stupid part is when your ST chooses to play it out like a cock battle, "HA! Random PC vampire, look at me! I HAVE RESILIENCE 5, WATCH ME GET HIT BY THIS TRUCK."

Shit's stupid, man.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:19:00 No.14752999 Report

Quoted By:

Hunter is my favorite
Changeling second
Vampire third
Promethean fourth (though it's a great book, I've only every run one game so...)
Geist fifth (again a great book but I've never had a chance to play it)
Werewolf (meh forever meh)
Mage (for powergaming neckbeards)

But honestly, my vote goes towards playing a mortals game using the incfedibly flexible and easy to learn core system. You may even come to the conclusion that I have and spend most of the time running non-WoD games using the system.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:20:00 No.14753001 Report

Quoted By:

I was giddy with joy when I first started to read Gheist. After a more in-depth read though, I was dissapointed. Horrible Faustian bargain with a spirit of death to return to life? Hell yes. Bibding/eating ghost, going turf war with other Sin-eaters? Awesome. No repercussions for a lot of the dark stuff, general celebration of life, happy fun time? Yeah, no. Not a lot of horror in the way they fleshed-out the setting. The Geist just sits back and maybe bitches at you to do something.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:22:00 No.14753008 Report

Quoted By: >>14754874

Personally I've been very excited by and enjoyed *reading* every nWoD theme book but i've rarely had a chance to actually PLAY them. Longest games we've had in my group have been Vampire or Mortals. Thankfully our ST isn't the kind to focus on the "BROODY CREATURES OF DARKNESS" trope.

The one I'd like to try the most is Promethean. But it looks like a lot of the different rules don't quite fit together. Like the different gameplay mechanics were made by different people who never bothered to check if they fit together right.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:32:00 No.14753066 Report

Quoted By:

I usually run HtV games, it's easy for new players to get in, and it's interesting line.
Risking is neat, tactics encourage teamwork, and it's easier to get my players on the mood, because their characters just a little bit above average man, I don't run third tier games, but even with third tier Hunters are underdogs in most cases.
Some may say Hunters is a stupid book, because "it's just mortals, and book contains almost nothing of interest", I disagree.
Oh, and supplements for this line is just plain awesome in my opinion, don't be fooled Slasher is no general WoD book, it's HtV, I don't know why they released it as WoD book.
I still don't understand point of Triggers though, yeah, it's an interesting idea, but if you're risking -3 to all social rolls, you can take you chances on morality roll. But tells are cool.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:46:00 No.14753154 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752998
>"HA! Random PC vampire, look at me! I HAVE RESILIENCE 5, WATCH ME GET HIT BY THIS TRUCK."
I wish this would happen in my games.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:48:00 No.14753159 Report

Quoted By:

>>14752947
Actually Hunter can be pretty deep, just play with compacts and conspiracies, add supers, government, companies, etc to the mix for more fun.
Hunters is crossover central.
Maybe it's not the deepest line, but it in no means shallow.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 22:56:00 No.14753206 Report

Quoted By:

>The one I'd like to try the most is Promethean. But it looks like a lot of the different rules don't quite fit together. Like the different gameplay mechanics were made by different people who never bothered to check if they fit together right.

Seems appropriate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Apr 2011 23:06:00 No.14753272 Report

Quoted By:

>>14749430

Go for Werewolf: the Forsaken. Rules may be a bit too complex to handle at first, but it's incredibly fleshed out system and reading rulebook is true pleasure, even mechanical part in which for ex. every ritual has description full of little tasty parts you can use as potential plothooks. It's fairly easily to exploit main concepts of a setting, but it's equally simple to shift approach and/or mood. Paradoxally, if told appropriate, W:tF is ideal for horror stories.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Apr 2011 02:43:00 No.14754874 Report

Quoted By:

>>14753008
I concur. Just look at the Transmution rolls. They vary from Attribute+Azoth, Skill+Azoth, Attribute+Skill+Azoth, or any other combination of practically anything.

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